Saturday, August 13, 2005
I happened to pass one of those fake convertibles the other day. You know, a Buick or something like that with a vinyl or canvas top made to look like a convertible. But it doesn’t go down. It just has the look. That seems so ridiculous to me.
7 Comments:
The population of Rhode Island is 52% Roman Catholic, making it the most Catholic state in the union. Why all the religion? Why all the being good and following tradition? You raise a good point. But that's why God places us here - to point out the folly of these ways and show them the Light as revealed in God's Word.
It is difficult for me to understand how the only motivating factor behind living a life of good instead of evil would be the quest to please god. That implies a separation between us and god that I do not believe exists. It is most definitely not intrinsic human nature to take everything at any expense (although it could be easily argued that capitalism proves me wrong on this.) We have the gift of self-awareness and intelligence that allows us to see ourselves within a larger context of humanity. We know love, charity, kindness. We possess a drive to improve our lives and communities. If you want to say that all of this goodness comes from/is inspired by god, then I won’t argue. But don’t say that it comes from the desire to please god. It is already within us- some choose to nurture that, others deny it. The choice has little to do with religion.
Also, what noticed about your reasoning is that you used the word ‘Christian’. there are countless other religions and spiritual pathways that guide people toward a closer connection with the divine- toward a life that is consistent with Christ’s teachings. All spirituality has that connection, and the differentiation only serves to divide us even more.
This is what I’ve come to understand in this life. Yes, I believe in god- but I also believe in the amazing strength and compassion that I see before me every single day in the form of people.
I'll stop ranting now. Thanks for bringing this stuff up for discussion. I absolutely LOVE that you related it to that stupid fake convertible PT cruiser.
And also, I'd be willing to bet that I'd like you just fine if you never encountered Christianity.
Because you think.
Dear F.A.,
Thanks for the vote of confidence, and also for your rant. I sincerely appreciate it all. I heartily agree that "the choice has little to do with religion." And it seems we are at least on a similar vector in the direction of agreement by your saying "If you want to say that all of this goodness comes from/is inspired by god, then I won’t argue." For me it all boils down to a relationship to God. And obviously, my belief is that Christ makes that relationship possible. Be that as it may, trying to take account of just my own self, not anyone else, I have to face the blackness of my soul apart from God. Thinking or not, it's not pretty.
I do not try to do good in this world to please God. I try to do good in this world because it is right. I try, as much as possible, to live by the golden rule: do unto others as you would have them do unto you. I don't want others stealing my identity, hurting me, badmouthing me behind my back, spitting in my restaurant dishes, taking my money but giving me no product or service in return, etc.
The world is full of folks who are just trying to be nice to each other. Who may be a wee tad hypocritical in one way or another, who do stupid things occasionally, who accidentally (or on purpose) hurt others, but who don't do it for funsies or jollies. People who also are trying to live by the golden rule.
The question of morality being born out of religion is one of those that has always boggled me. While I respect that your belief is central to who you are, and you seem to be sincerely trying to be a good person, to me the idea of Doing Good To Please God seems like a grown-up version of just being good because mom & dad want you to. Where is there the "do good because it's the right thing to do" there? There are a lot of people out there who are "Christians" who seem to Do Good (sorta) Because Otherwise God Is Gonna Getcha. And there are lots of folks of all religions who do what they think of as good, but end up hurting lots of other people (the Crusades, terrorists, people who beat their children in the name of discipline).
Meaty entry. Thanks.
Kate
Hello Kate,
Maybe there is something built into females having to do with nurturing that really is built in goodness. Maybe it’s just us guys that are basically shmucks when left to our own devices.
I do see your point about the golden rule. We do or don’t do based on the way we want to be treated. That stands on its own. But it would seem there are situations it doesn’t cover. Like the stories we’ve heard about heroic deeds such as a soldier jumping on a grenade to save his friends. It’s not like the friends can catch the next one to return the favor. There is no next time. I don’t know, maybe you can still get the golden rule to stretch over that. But I think those kinds of selfless actions are sacrifice based on love. It seems to me it really doesn’t have much to do with give and take but is all about giving in a one sided way; A giving without expecting anything in return. Like I said, maybe women can naturally do that, but I think a man generally needs some kind of outside influence to get to that point.
The idea of God standing by to “getcha” if you aren’t good, though common, is unfortunate. I believe we have been given models such as the family to help us begin to understand God. I love my relationships with my kids and we enjoy each other. I don’t delight in hovering over them, waiting for them to do something wrong so I can let them have it. When they do things I know are not good for them it grieves me because I want only good things for them. When they do something for me that they know I will like, it makes me very happy. I love them so much and it’s wonderful when they love me back. But even if they didn’t for whatever reason, I would still love them immensely. If they ran away from me and didn’t want to have anything to do with me, I would try to draw them back and would be in sorrow until I did. This is my picture of God based on what I have read in scripture. I see a God who commands me to live in ways that will be good for me. And I see prohibitions that are there to protect me from things that would hurt me. I may not understand the reasons for all these things. A child may not understand why his father tells him not to touch the pretty cherry red stove. But I believe it is all based on the premise that God loves me and all of us.
Anyway, I’m rambling here, but doing good out of a selfless love will get a lot further down the road than the golden rule, wise as it is. But in my experience this kind of love is not something we naturally possess. I believe its God supplied. But then, again, I’m a guy.
By the way, you and Fa got me to thinking about some things re: thinking and belief that I’m going to put in another post.
ya'll (as we say here in the south) might find this recent post from a Christian friend of mine quite interesting:
http://rodsrants.blogspot.com/2005/08/look.html
I am searching for a faux/simulated/carriagetop/shell for a 2003 Buick Park Avenue. I think one form 1997 to 2005 will fit. Please contact me at kalamazoorob@gmail.com. Thank, Robert
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